Middle Mass

Lyrics

(1)

The evil is not in extremes
It's in the aftermath
The middle mass (2)
After the fact
Vulturous in the aftermath

Summer close season (3)
A quiet dope and cider man
But during the season
Hard drugs and cider mates

The boy is like a tape loop
The boy is like a uh-uh

Not much contact
Drinking, the men wait
They are set at nought  (4)
Cause cripple state's a holy state
Cause cripple state's a holy state (5)
The Wehrmacht never got in here 
The Wehrmacht never got in here
The Wehrmacht never got in here
The Wehrmacht never got in here
Though it took us six years    (6)
The Wehrmacht never got in here
The Wehrmacht never got in here
The Wehrmacht never got in here
The worm never got in here (7)
And living here you whisper, bub
And living here you whisper, bub!  (8)

This boy is like a tape loop
And he has soft mitts
And he's the last domain
Of a very very black room brain   (9)
He learned a word today
The word's misanthropy
And he's running to and from
The cats from tin pan alley (10)
And he's running with and from
The cats from the alleys of tin pan
And he's going down the alley
Take the cats from the alleys of tin pan
The alley's full of cats from tin pan

The middle mass
The middle mass, vulturous in the aftermath
It's the back room brain

His motive: revenge  (11)

(12)


 

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Notes

1. Reader undigest identifies the title as a German-to-English calque, i.e. a "play on the German noun 'Mittelmaß,' meaning 'average' or 'mediocrity.'  This is almost certainly the correct derivation of the title as it fits perfectly in context. It should be noted that the calque is not necessarily MES's though, as this phrase sometimes appears in English.

As with C.R.E.E.P., this song is often thought to be about Marc Riley, who says lost repect for MES when he confronted him about it and the latter denied it, saying that it was about another guy named "Marc/Mark." This is from an interview with the Fall fanzine The Pseud Mag:

A question which you definitely don't have to answer if you don't wish to! Do you still think Middle Mass is about yours truly [sic]? 

Mark and I weren’t getting on at all. He’d pull all sorts of stunts. You’d get a record back from the pressing plant and the writing credits bore no resemblance to the people who wrote it – stuff like that - so I used to argue with him a lot. I overheard him saying to someone (Grant Showbiz I think) that Middle Mass was about me. I approached Mark about it and he denied it – that was it for me. Not that he’d written the song about me – just that he didn’t have the balls to admit it. ‘The boy is like a tape loop’! Ha! I took that as a compliment –and ‘he has cider mates’...well Steve, Craig and I were inseparable and had the same tight circle of friends so that seemed a bit of a misguided dig at me personally. From thereon in we were pretty much finished.

The following note from the Lyrics Parade throws light on the background of the song, or doesn't:

This song is apparently about Marc Riley. Riley had spent the previous summer staying in London at a flat in Denmark Street (the UK's "Tin Pan Alley") with Mike Gaines, a budding songwriter and notorious heroin addict. For a few months there was talk of Gaines and Riley forming their own group, or at least writing and selling their own songs. Smith got wind of this and there was a bit of a showdown - Smith taking the piss out of Riley for allegedly experimenting with harder drugs, messing about with "proper" tunes and hanging around with a loser like Gaines. Riley retorted by calling Smith a "misanthropic old git", which amused Smith as Riley said it more than once ("like a tape loop"), obviously pleased as punch with the new word he'd learned. "Soft mitts" refers to Riley's ineffectuality as a fighter. [Analysis by Fallnet's Paul Saxton]

ADDENDUM 2004: After the above "analysis" was repeated by Mick Middles in his book on The Fall, it came to light that the story had been a complete fabrication all along. But rather a clever one! [editor]"

On the other hand, according to Riley:  "I overheard [Smith] saying to someone (Grant Showbiz I think) that Middle Mass was about me."

According to Hanley's The Big Midweek, Riley was very upset when he heard the vocals being recorded, and confronted MES in the studio, at which point the latter denied that it was about the former.

Paul Hanley, on a panel at the 2013 Louder Then Words festival in Manchester, said he doesn't hear anything at all about Riley in the lyrics.

See Phil's comment (#55 below) for a more detailed account of Riley's take on the lyrics.

In his spoken introduction to the song on the Fall's 9/12/1981 gig at Austurbaejarbio, Iceland, MES says that the song is about football hooliganism, and this definitely seems to be one of the themes of these complex lyrics. Switzerland also seems to get mixed up in it somehow, as MES mentions it a few times in his patter before live versions ("you wanna know about Oslo, you wanna know about Switzerland"; "It's a pure prophecy as regards to Switzerland. Now, isn't that clear?"; "This is for all the Swiss in the audience.").

The title of the song may be a play on Middlemarch, the 1871 novel by George Eliot.  

Dan:

From the reverse of the Slates cover: "MIDDLE MASS

U are what you call-but it's better than becoming the New Swiss. A HOLY Characterisation."

^

2. Mark Smith often expresses contempt for the middle class, and more quotes like the following will not be hard for the enterprising reader to unearth:

"What really annoys me is that people can't really get into their head that there really isn't any threat from the left or the right really. The threat is some kind of standardized horrible society. Run by a bunch of fucking idiots." On at least one live version, "the boy" is "running from the middle mass."

^

3. "Close season" denotes the off-season in football (soccer). According to Wikipedia:

The off-season, vacation time, or close season is the time of year when there is no official competition. Although upper management continues to work, the athletes will take much vacation time off. Also, various events such as drafts, transfers and important off-season free agent signings occur. Generally, most athletes stay in shape during the off-season in preparation for the next season. Certain new rules in the league may be made during this time, and will become enforced during the next regular season.
As most countries which have a league in a particular sport will operate their regular season at roughly the same time as the others, international tournaments may be arranged during the off season.
For example, most European football league club competitions run from July or August to May, subsequently major international competitions such as the FIFA World Cup and UEFA European Football Championship are organised to occur in June and July.

Presumably the person the song is about (whether Marc Riley, someone else, or a hybrid or entirely fictional character) is fairly docile in the off-season but resumes his hooliganish ways when the season commences (see note 1). 

^

4. "Set at nought"--to to be disregarded, ignored, dismissed, treated with contempt-- also pops up in "Prole Art Threat."

^

5. Throughout the history of Christendom, people with disabilities were sometimes thought to be children of God, and in some way blessed. 

^

6.  World War II lasted from 1939-1945.

^

7. Although MES has at times expressed patriotic sentiments, I read this line as a sarcastic dig at the self-congratulatory smugness of the British middle class. "The worm never got in here" in the penultimate line may just be a flub ("the wehrm-") since it doesn't appear on any live versions or Peel. Still, it seems to fit. 

This may also be a reference to Switzerland (see note 1 above)! 

^

8. MES also uses the generic, informal term of address "bub" in "Pay Your Rates" ("Living here you whisper, bub!"). "Bub," which has its origin in the mid-19th century USA, is seemingly not common in England.

^

9. SB points out that MES favorite Colin Wilson has a novel called The Black Room.

^

10. See the note from the Lyrics Parade quoted in note 1.

^

11. niallo11:

"The phrase “Motive: Revenge” appears on the sleeve of Oh! Brother. I recall Smith mentioning it in an interview at the time as a call-back."

^

12. Martin transcribed the lyrics to "Middle Mass Explanation," a rap MES sometimes did before the song. This is from September 30, 1981:

Ride in my long varied career
Incident
English goes in every bar in Europe
And think, is it some kind of exception?
You wanna know about Switzerland
You wanna know about Oslo
Violence
Well, I sat down, he sat down
You always sit down
Anyway – this is M-Mass Explanation
And people go round and round Europe
And they think everything is an exception
They go in a bar and think there’s some kind of, er, wealth here
But they know it’s standard
When they know its standard
That’s when they hit out
A mere bold attentuation
M-Mass – S.H.

So, that explains everything! No more questions!

No? Ok, Dan expounds:

There were two serious football related riots in 1981, both connected to England matches as part of world cup qualification.

In May 1981, there were riots on the occasion of England's match against Switzerland in Basle.  

Then on 9 September 1981, there were riots on the occasion of the England-Norway match in Oslo.

Hence, Middle Mass Explanation is pointing out the prescience of Middle Mass, which of course predates the Basle and Oslo violence.

^

 

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More Information

Middle Mass: Fall Tracks A-Z

Dan:

The blue lyrics book has page on which a "Middle Mass"-esque text is pasted over extracts from the book Chronicle of the Twentieth Century about Nazi book burning and Marlene Dietrich. Provenance unclear. The text reads (original is all in capitals too, some bits indistinct, so I've missed them out):

THE EVILS NOT IN EXTREMES. ITS THE ONE WHO KICKS THE LAST. ITS THE ONE WHO KICKS THE DEAD. ITS THE AFTERMATH. THE ONE WHO THROWS THE LAST BOOK ON THE FIRE. THE MIDDLE MASS. COME ALONE. COME ALONG. MEET THE MIDDLE MASS. THE MIDDLE MASS. VULTUROUS. VULTUROUS. AFTER THE FACT. AFTER THE FACT. THE MIDDLE MASS. THE ONE WHO THROWS THE LAST. WOE, WOE, WOE, WOE, WOE, WOE, WOE ETCETERA.... WE ARE THE FALL! LAUGH! LAUGH! I TELL YA, LAUGH, I NEARLY... I TELL YA, LAUGH... AFTER THE GRAMMAR. PLEDGE SHOWS WITH THE SON OF MIKE PARKINSON, MADE FROM COAL. MADE FROM COAL. YEH! WE LOST ONE OF OUR LADS TODAY, WE LOST ONE OF OUR LADS THE OTHER DAY, HE WAS FROM MANCHESTER. OH GOD! WELL ER, THE NEXT THING WILL BE AFTER THE FACT. AFTER THE GRAMMAR THE SON OF MIKE PARKINSON , THE SON OF MIKE PARKINSON, MADE FROM COAL. AND YOULL HAVE ALL THESE PLEDGE CENTRES ALL THE SPEECH PSYCHOS FROM 78, YEH, THE ONES WHO HAVNT GOT INTO ADAM AND THE ANTS, HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! 

 

Comments (105)

dannyno
  • 1. dannyno | 18/03/2013
"summer close season"

Does this refer to the closing of the transfer window in soccer?
bzfgt
  • 2. bzfgt | 18/03/2013
I took it to mean the closeness of the weather, it's hot and muggy which is when people say the weather is "close."
dannyno
  • 3. dannyno | 22/03/2013
But "close season" - that's not a phrase anyone uses, and it's not very MES language. Reads better if it's about soccer season vs non-soccer season.
bzfgt
  • 4. bzfgt | 23/03/2013
Here's Wikipediahttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Season_(sports)#Off-season:

The off-season, vacation time, or close season is the time of year when there is no official competition. Although upper management continues to work, the athletes will take much vacation time off. Also, various events such as drafts, transfers and important off-season free agent signings occur. Generally, most athletes stay in shape during the off-season in preparation for the next season. Certain new rules in the league may be made during this time, and will become enforced during the next regular season.
As most countries which have a league in a particular sport will operate their regular season at roughly the same time as the others, international tournaments may be arranged during the off season.
For example, most European football league club competitions run from July or August to May, subsequently major international competitions such as the FIFA World Cup and UEFA European Football Championship are organised to occur in June and July.
dannyno
  • 5. dannyno | 24/03/2013
In "The Fall Lyrics" (Lough Press), there's what is apparently a diary entry (on a page dated May 31), which reads:

"Date: Early Jan: write 'Middle Mass', a song about football vandalism, violent w/class, myself, record biz."

Make of that what you will.
bzfgt
  • 6. bzfgt | 02/04/2013
Cool, I'm convinced you're right about "close season" now, since he goes on to contrast it with "during the season." I'm going to get some of this up in the notes when I get a chance; in the meantime, I hope people read these comments.
John
  • 7. John | 01/08/2013
Some things I have gleaned over the years, mostly by listening to live versions:
The song (in grand MES tradition of being about several things at once) is also about Switzerland, as he says "here's to all the Swiss in the audience" in one live version and in Middle Mass Explanation (if I remember the title) he says "you wanna know about Oslo, you wanna know about Switzerland" and "you go into every bar in Europe and people think they are some sort of exception" and "when you know that they are standard, that's when they hit out". This also ties into "cripple states are holy states" (my interpretation of what he's saying). The whole "the Weremacht never got in here" is another huge reference for Switzerland.
Set at nought is an Elizabethan turn of phrase.
The middle class thing is emphasized in another live version where he talks about "it's the one who kicks the last....the one who throws that last book on the fire"
Martin
  • 8. Martin | 06/02/2014
Some during-gig quotes to back up the football and Swiss themes expounded on above:

31 May 1981 Oklahoma City: It's a pure prophecy as regards to Switzerland. Now, isn't that clear?" (before "Middle Mass")

(Same date): "This next one is about soccer, sort of...it's pure prophecy as regards to Italy."

11 June 1981 Spit, Boston: "OK, this is 'Middle Mass'. A form of true prophesy. True prophesy! When English boys get over to Europe they think this is an exception. But everywhere is like that! And they can't quite figure out why the welfare is twice their wages! Why they can't speak their language! Why Britain is not as great when you get overseas, mate!"

12 June 81 City Gardens, Trenton: "This is for all the Swiss in the audience."

12 September 81 Austerbaejarbio, Reykjavik: "To get back to football hooliganism... football hooliganism... there's a song about it called 'Middle Mass.'
Martin
  • 9. Martin | 06/02/2014
I suppose there's a case for including Middle Mass Explanation as a separate entry, both on this site and on Reformation!, given that it's included as a separate track on the red box set. Not sure, though...for me, it's more pre-song banter than real track.
Martin
  • 10. Martin | 07/02/2014
Here in any case, for completeness' sake at least, are the lyrics of Middle Mass Explanation as "sung" before Middle Mass on 9 September 1981:

"(Ride to?) my long varied career
(3 quick, almost unintelligible symbols, obscured by someone in the crowd shouting “Waheey!” – possibly just the word INCIDENT)
My English (closed?) in every bar in Europe
And think, is it some kind of exception?
You wanna know about Switzerland
You wanna know about Oslo
Violence
Well, I sat down, he sat down
You always sit down
Anyway – this is M-Mass Explanation
And people go round and round Europe
And they think everything is an exception
They (walk-in-a?) bar and think there’s some kind of, er, wealth here
But they know it’s standard
When they know its standard
That’s when they hit out
A mere [very quiet now] (bones?) attentuation
M-Mass – S.H."
bzfgt
  • 11. bzfgt | 12/02/2014
Wow, there seems to be something important hiding in those last few comments but I'm mystified. Maybe I'll do an "Explanation" entry ay some point...not tonight, though...
dannyno
  • 12. dannyno | 05/03/2014
"Hard drug and cider mates"

It's "Hard drugs".

Dan
dannyno
  • 13. dannyno | 05/03/2014
the last bit:

"And he's running to and from
The cats from tin pan alley
And he's running with and from
The cats from tin pan alley
And going down the alley
Take the cats from the alley
Up to them
The alley's full of cats from tin pan

Come into the back room Brian
And meet
The middle mass
The middle mass
Vulturous in the aftermath
Middle mass"

This is not what I'm hearing. What I'm hearing is this:

"And he's running to and from
The cats from tin pan alley
And he's running with and from
The cats from the alleys of tin pan
And he's going down the alley
To meet the cats from the alleys of tin pan
The alley's full of cats from tin pan
The middle mass
The middle mass
Vulturous in the aftermath"

I can't make out the line which here includes "Brian". I don't think it's "Brian". It's in parentheses in the Orange Lyrics book, for what that's worth.
bzfgt
  • 14. bzfgt | 11/03/2014
I just listened and made some changes, mostly what you have. I do think I hear "Brian," whatever it is it's less syllables than "come into the back room." I got it as close as I can for now.
bzfgt
  • 15. bzfgt | 23/04/2014
I can't believe I had "Wehrmacht" misspelled for over a year and Danny never noticed! Whew, that was a close one. I copied and pasted it from the Lyrics Parade and never noticed...if anyone was concerned with maintaining that site I'd tell them about it. I assume that if anyone ever does make any revisions over there it will be you, Danny, so if you ever do that, there's something for you to do...
dannyno
  • 16. dannyno | 13/08/2014
Steve Hanley's "The Big Midweek" tells the story of how Marc Riley confronted MES over the lyrics to this song, which he believed were about him.

p.75:

""That song's slagging em off," he says, "That song's about me!" .... <snip> ... "It's not about you, You're paranoid. You think everything's about you!" retorts Mark Smith."
dannyno
  • 17. dannyno | 11/09/2014
Paul Hanley said he couldn't hear anything relevant to Riley in the song, during the Louder Than Words interview: http://z1.invisionfree.com/thefall/index.php?showtopic=36396&view=findpost&p=22285134
bzfgt
  • 18. bzfgt | 03/11/2014
Martin, are you sure the MM Explanation you transcribed is from 9 September? It's pretty well identical to the one on the Box Set which the FOF discography says is September 30...
bzfgt
  • 19. bzfgt | 03/11/2014
What the hell is he talking about? What do people think is an exception but find out is standard? That everybody in Europe connects tons of welfare?
Martin
  • 20. Martin | 07/11/2014
Re commentary no. 18: yes, you are right. Typo on my behalf.
dannyno
  • 21. dannyno | 22/12/2014
I'm now getting Ayn Rand vibes from some of the lyrics of this song, especially the whole "evil is not in extremes" thing.
bzfgt
  • 22. bzfgt | 01/01/2015
You strike me as an ex-Randroid...am I right?
dannyno
  • 23. dannyno | 01/01/2015
Ha! No way! But I can see why you'd say that :-)
bzfgt
  • 24. bzfgt | 31/01/2015
It's because you're really articulate, spend a lot of time on the internet, and are a bit of a rationalist, so the rest was just guessing since so many people who meet that description are either Randos or ex-.
russell richardson
  • 25. russell richardson | 25/04/2015
no reason to add this, no 'proof' but I have always heard
"the women never got in here"
referring (in my mnd) to the last legal challenges for working men only 'clubs' (i.e. pubs, or sometimes even just the snug (partitioned off corner of a bar with unspoken restrictions for 'regulars')) one of which (on Cheetam Hill Rd MC) fought successfully (for 6 years?) to keep women out on the grounds that a club did not need to accept everyone as a member (though that wasn't the point). I seem to recall that a similar slant was used to keep blacks out... either way, it's an interesting and plausible line from the song.
undigest
  • 26. undigest | 27/09/2015
I always thought the title was a play on the German noun "Mittelmaß", meaning "average" or "mediocrity" -- http://www.wordreference.com/deen/Mittelma%C3%9F.
bzfgt
  • 27. bzfgt | 15/11/2015
Word to mama, undigest, that is perfect!
dannyno
  • 28. dannyno | 26/05/2016
"You wanna know about Switzerland
You wanna know about Oslo
Violence"

Nobody has noted the obvious yet, I see. This is all about football hooliganism.

There were two serious football related riots in 1981, both connected to England matches as part of world cup qualification.

In May 1981, there were riots on the occasion of England's match against Switzerland in Basle.
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/international/switzerland-vs-england-it-cant-be-as-ugly-for-england-as-basel-81-9717345.html

https://footballviolence.wordpress.com/2012/11/23/switzerland-england-1981/

Then on 9 September 1981, there were riots on the occasion of the England-Norway match in Oslo.

https://footballviolence.wordpress.com/2012/12/21/norway-england-1981/

Hence, Middle Mass Explanation is pointing out the prescience of Middle Mass, which of course predates the Basle and Oslo violence.
bzfgt
  • 29. bzfgt | 24/06/2016
Yes, I have seen it said a bunch of places also that this is what "Middle Mass" is about in general, I'm surprised upon looking that I've barely alluded to it in the notes.
bzfgt
  • 30. bzfgt | 24/06/2016
Oh never mind, I had missed the first note somehow when I wrote that last comment.
bzfgt
  • 31. bzfgt | 19/11/2016
Dan, do you remember what Brix said? I thought the note (1) was thorough and I already incorporated it, but I did not; she gives an alternate non-Riley account, doesn't she? I'll have to search my Kindle...
bzfgt
  • 32. bzfgt | 19/11/2016
No, I was thinking of "C.R.E.E.P." Brix doesn't weigh in (it was before her time but I thought she claimed to know something).
Zack
  • 33. Zack (link) | 29/12/2016
A few words about song structures:

In the May 1983 issue of International Musician and Recording World, MES explained "Some songs are so structured, they're structured for like each word and the band knows exactly what word to change the beat or the tune on."

We hear this in a crude form on two songs on Grotesque in which MES shouts "switch" and the band does exactly that, but we hear it in a more sophisticated form on "Middle Mass." By comparing live versions, it is clear that when Smith sings "And living here you whisper, bub" for the second time, that is the drummer's cue to thud on the tom-toms four times and for the band to go into the second part of the song.
dannyno
  • 34. dannyno | 13/02/2017
"Learned a word today"

Echoes of Mary Poppins?!

"https://perryjgreenbaum.blogspot.co.uk/2011/01/supercalifragilisticexpialidocious-mary.html

Take a look and see what you think :-)


Because I was afraid to speak
When I was just a lad
My father gave me nose a tweak
And told me I was bad
But then one day I learned a word
That saved me achin' nose
dannyno
  • 35. dannyno | 09/03/2017
"They are set at nought"

Worth noting that in "Prole Art Threat", also on Slates, the phrase "set at nought like a Wimpey crane" appears.
dannyno
  • 36. dannyno | 09/03/2017
"And living here you whisper, bub"

Let's have an explanation of non-UK slang for a change. "Bub" is US slang for "boy" or Australian/New Zealand slang for "baby".
dannyno
  • 37. dannyno | 09/03/2017
Note #6 : the lyrics parade link no longer works.

The text is still accessible through the internet archive: http://web.archive.org/web/20080210140231/http://fall.byethost13.com/lyrics.html
bzfgt
  • 38. bzfgt (link) | 19/03/2017
Set at nought--oh yeah, quite right.

I added to note one "It should be noted that the calque is not necessarily MES's though, as this phrase sometimes appears in English." I had never seen it until recently. But now I wonder if it was a Fall-aware reporter or something--this is an English phrase, right?
bzfgt
  • 39. bzfgt (link) | 19/03/2017
I just blacked it, this place is becoming the place where links go to die. The enterprising reader will be able to figure out what the Lyrics Parade is. But I have to probably now either black them all out or hook them to the new lyrics pages, I suppose. The odds I'll commit to doing the latter are considerably less than zero.
bzfgt
  • 40. bzfgt (link) | 19/03/2017
Does "bub" really need a note? No one in England says "bub"?
dannyno
  • 41. dannyno | 20/03/2017
"Bub" is very uncommon. I don't recall ever hearing anyone say it in everyday life.
dannyno
  • 42. dannyno | 20/03/2017
"Set at nought" is an English phrase, yes. But I think its origins are in the King James Version of the Bible.

Proverbs I


But ye have set at nought all my counsel, and would none of my reproof


https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Proverbs+1&version=KJV

Also in Shakespeare: Henry IV Part 2: Act 5, Scene 2:


Chief Justice: Be you contented, wearing now the garland,
To have a son set your decrees at nought?
dannyno
  • 43. dannyno | 20/03/2017
That should have been proverbs 1, verse 25, but it came out as an emoticon!
dannyno
  • 44. dannyno | 20/03/2017
Also:

Mark 9 : 12


And he answered and told them, Elias verily cometh first, and restoreth all things; and how it is written of the Son of man, that he must suffer many things, and be set at nought.


Luke 23 : 11


And Herod with his men of war set him at nought, and mocked him, and arrayed him in a gorgeous robe, and sent him again to Pilate.


Acts 4 : 11


This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.


Acts 19 : 27


So that not only this our craft is in danger to be set at nought


Romans 14 : 10


But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.


"To set" means "to rate" or "to value", you see.
bzfgt
  • 45. bzfgt (link) | 23/03/2017
Odd. I wouldn't say it's common here, but it is common in the sense that everyone would at least know how it's used.
dannyno
  • 46. dannyno | 25/06/2017
From the reverse of the "Slates" cover:


MIDDLE MASS

U are what you call-but it's better than becoming the New Swiss. A HOLY Characterisation.
bzfgt
  • 47. bzfgt (link) | 09/07/2017
"U are what you call" in original?
dannyno
  • 48. dannyno | 09/07/2017
Yep, that's how it's typed.
dannyno
  • 49. dannyno | 09/07/2017
"New Swiss" I think is intended in a sense like "the British are becoming the New Swiss", rather than "the rise of the New Swiss", if you see what I mean.
bzfgt
  • 50. bzfgt (link) | 15/07/2017
Yes I do.
peudent
  • 51. peudent | 12/02/2018
Despite MES' denial, he did write at least one song about Riley - "Hey! Marc Riley", which was hardly flattering lyrically.
dannyno
  • 52. dannyno | 13/02/2018
Not sure what you mean by "despite". It could be true of one song (obviously so in the case of "Hey! Marc Riley") and not another. And remember Paul Hanley also said he couldn't hear any Riley content either).
bzfgt
  • 53. bzfgt (link) | 13/02/2018
He surely did not deny that "Hey! Marc Riley" is about Marc Riley, did he?!
dannyno
  • 54. dannyno | 17/02/2018
Of course not!
Phil
  • 55. Phil | 24/07/2018
The version Marc Riley told me, years ago, was that more or less everything up to the Wehrmacht line was about him. It was partly MES taking the piss out of him for hanging out with Craig Scanlon & Steve Hanley ("cider mates"; Marc also thought the 'mitts' line was "he has soft mates", i.e. calling CS and SH stupid).

But the main thing was the 'tape loop' line. This went back to "Spectre vs Rector" on Dragnet, on which Riley played a relentlessly unvarying guitar riff - the first of many! A fan had written to Smith saying that she really liked the "tape loop" on the track; MES seized on this and kept telling the band that that was what he wanted, a band so tight they could be a tape loop! Of course, when Riley & MES fell out the idea of being 'like a tape loop' took on less flattering connotations.

When I spoke to him, a couple of years after the events, Marc was still genuinely aggrieved by these references - including "The boy is like a- uh, uh", which he took this to be a (slightly childish) bit of self-censoring from MES. (As far as 'boy' goes, Riley was 19 at this point to MES's 24 - little wonder he preferred to hang out with people who were (a) nearer his own age and (b) not MES.)

The rest of the story, as he told it to me, was pretty much as quoted above. He'd put two and two together and confronted MES - "Is this song about me?" - to which MES had replied "No, it's about someone else called Mark" and made a swift exit. On his account, Marc hadn't heard any rumours about the song being about 'someone called Mark', so MES was really condemned out of his own mouth here.
bzfgt
  • 56. bzfgt (link) | 29/07/2018
Excellent stuff, Phil!

Dan--do you have a source for that "of course not"?
bzfgt
  • 57. bzfgt (link) | 29/07/2018
Well, the link to "another guy named Marc(/Mark)" is dead, so I guess it's good you've corroborated although I wish I;d known about Wayback Machine when I posted that...
bzfgt
  • 58. bzfgt (link) | 29/07/2018
This really sucks because, while I don't doubt your account, I had Riley on record with that and now I've lost it. That's not the direction the notes should be moving in! The entries before Dan told me of Wayback Machine are like a graveyard for links and some things that used to be adequately documented are now less so, which is a problem because often-- probably more often than not--there's no mention of the source, just a hotlink in the text. When I began this, I was naive about how long things on the internet hang around, figuring that since they don't take up any space, they probably linger more or less forever...so the end result is, it's now not clear what my sources are in many cases, and something that was nailed down in 2013 may be tenuous in 2018.
dannyno
  • 59. dannyno | 05/08/2018
Riley's umbrage is a bit ridiculous. Even if the song was about him, and just because he thinks there is doesn't mean there is, if you look at the content it's not exactly in the top ten of all time vicious takedowns, is it? I suppose it might be the denial that was annoying, but come on.
bzfgt
  • 60. bzfgt (link) | 16/08/2018
Yeah, I guess though he was younger and insecure and having to play songs making fun of him (or I mean that's what he thought in either case)
Bazhdaddy
  • 61. Bazhdaddy | 05/02/2019
There's a whispered second vocal at various times, sometimes doubles, sometimes deviates;
1:09 "running from the middlemass" [Peel : He's running from the middlemass]
and over the tin pan alley bit starting at 02:46 (far from sure about this);
"To barman : the middlemass, say too many object, to skinny mittelmass, mittelmass, vulturous in the aftermath"
at the end at 03:17 "his motive : revenge" this line is clearer on other versions

---------
in the last verse I hear
"but he's the last domain"
"black room brain"
at 2:57 "to meet the cats"
bzfgt
  • 62. bzfgt (link) | 21/03/2019
OK I think I can hear "His motive: revenge" but as usual it could be something else, like those videos on youtube where they play something backwards and you hear "glawaarthgqwaop" and then the Christian guy says "It's bugger me Satan" and then you play it again and hear that clearly. What might be helpful is if you give an example of another version where it's clearer?
niallo11
  • 63. niallo11 | 05/01/2020
The phrase “Motive: Revenge” appears on the sleeve of Oh! Brother. I recall Smith mentioning it in an interview at the time as a call-back.
bzfgt
  • 64. bzfgt (link) | 19/01/2020
OK I got motive:revenge in I can hear that now. I'll have to try to fill in what's just before it it's very unclear just now
Dr X O'Skeleton
  • 65. Dr X O'Skeleton | 21/01/2020
On the "bub" line, there is also a "Hey bub!" shouted at the end Pay Your Rates. As noted earlier, it's not a particularly English expression. Research suggests a US origin, dating back to the 40s. There is a 1983 Rickie Lee Jones song Hey Bub, which post-dates these Fall songs.
bzfgt
  • 66. bzfgt (link) | 25/01/2020
I do seem to hear "Hey bub!" in PYR, good call.
Martin
  • 67. Martin | 27/04/2020
Back after 6 years to brain/Brian. I definitely hear Brian in the penultimate line. And there are these (and probably more) live examples:

26 March 1982, Swindon: "Just walk down this corridor, Brian...third door on your left."
9 April 2004, NYC: (22 years later!) "Come into the back room, Brian. And you've already done that, because you are Brian and you are a mother and father."

Now, was there anyone called Brian known to the group at the time or since? This comment (presumably made to a sound or lighting engineer) is the only reference I can find, but it's a very early one:

17 December 1978, London: "Brian, sort out the (...)." (before Frightened)
Martin Peters
  • 68. Martin Peters | 27/04/2020
Re comment no.7 ("The middle class thing is emphasized in another live version where he talks about 'it's the one who kicks the last....the one who throws that last book on the fire.'")

For example, Acklam Hall, London, 11 December 1980.
Martin
  • 69. Martin | 18/05/2020
"The Wehrmacht never got in here
Though it took us six years"

presumably a reference to the length of WW2?
Otherorganism
  • 70. Otherorganism | 05/06/2020
ah always thought it was " let me
hear you whisper ,Bob" in reference to OGWT "Whispering" Bob Harris haha ...
bzfgt
  • 71. bzfgt (link) | 14/06/2020
69: yes I always thought so, I guess I didn't realize it needed a note

70: maybe
Martin
  • 72. Martin | 15/06/2020
Believe me, there are loads of people who have no idea about WW2 dates.
bzfgt
  • 73. bzfgt (link) | 21/06/2020
Absolutely, I noted it.
dannyno
  • 74. dannyno | 18/10/2020
"worm never got in here" - note #7

There is, of course, the phrase "worm in the apple". Doesn't entirely fit idiomatically, but worth bearing in mind alongside the "flub" hypothesis.
dannyno
  • 75. dannyno | 18/10/2020
Matrimony is also a "holy state". That's as far as I got with that angle...
dannyno
  • 76. dannyno | 18/10/2020
Grant Showbiz, during a Tim-Burgess organised twitter listening party:


#TimsTwitterListeningParty I have no idea how anyone could conclude that Middle Mass is anything about Marc Riley ??
9:06 PM · Oct 18, 2020


https://twitter.com/zombat/status/1317919976712507392

The answer, of course is that Riley said he thought so!

Wisest comment is from Paul Hanley (note his interview comments cited earlier on this page):


Middlemass is another one where the bass line is practically the whole song. Rumour has it it’s about Marc, and probably some of it is, but it’s always dangerous to suggest Mark’s lyrics are about one thing.
#TimsTwitterListeningParty
9:02 PM · Oct 18, 2020


https://twitter.com/hanleyPa/status/1317918875380371458
BB
  • 77. BB | 11/11/2020
Though it took us six years = The win took us six years
BB
  • 78. BB | 11/11/2020
Scrap that. I miss heard. Again.
Anon
  • 79. Anon | 22/11/2020
Think the song was originally entitled 'after the gram' - see the "the son of Mike Parkinson made from coal" version on The Legendary Chaos Tape, London, 1980.

Maybe it started off as a drug song and turned into something else.
dannyno
  • 80. dannyno | 29/01/2021
The blue lyrics book has page on which a "Middle Mass"-esque text is pasted over extracts from the book Chronicle of the Twentieth Century about Nazi book burning and Marlene Dietrich. Provenance unclear.

The text reads (original is all in capitals too, some bits indistinct, so I've missed them out):


THE EVILS NOT IN EXTREMES. ITS THE ONE WHO KICKS THE LAST. ITS THE ONE WHO KICKS THE DEAD. ITS THE AFTERMATH. THE ONE WHO THROWS THE LAST BOOK ON THE FIRE. THE MIDDLE MASS. COME ALONE. COME ALONG. MEET THE MIDDLE MASS. THE MIDDLE MASS. VULTUROUS. VULTUROUS. AFTER THE FACT. AFTER THE FACT. THE MIDDLE MASS. THE ONE WHO THROWS THE LAST. WOE, WOE, WOE, WOE, WOE, WOE, WOE ETCETERA....

WE ARE THE FALL! LAUGH! LAUGH! I TELL YA, LAUGH, I NEARLY... I TELL YA, LAUGH... AFTER THE GRAMMAR. PLEDGE SHOWS WITH THE SON OF MIKE PARKINSON, MADE FROM COAL. MADE FROM COAL. YEH! WE LOST ONE OF OUR LADS TODAY, WE LOST ONE OF OUR LADS THE OTHER DAY, HE WAS FROM MANCHESTER. OH GOD! WELL ER, THE NEXT THING WILL BE AFTER THE FACT. AFTER THE GRAMMAR THE SON OF MIKE PARKINSON , THE SON OF MIKE PARKINSON, MADE FROM COAL. AND YOULL HAVE ALL THESE PLEDGE CENTRES ALL THE SPEECH PSYCHOS FROM 78, YEH, THE ONES WHO HAVNT GOT INTO ADAM AND THE ANTS, HA! HA! HA! HA! HA!


So there you go.
Durp
  • 81. Durp | 26/02/2021
Is it "black blue brain" and "cripple(d) states ARE holy states"?
bzfgt
  • 82. bzfgt (link) | 23/03/2021
Yeah I listened to some live versions and it's always "black room brain," got to listen to this again now
bzfgt
  • 83. bzfgt (link) | 23/03/2021
Yeah it's harder to tell here but in light of the live versions I'm convinced it's "black." Not sure about "black blue," I'll listen to some more versions
bzfgt
  • 84. bzfgt (link) | 23/03/2021
No, it's "room," or anyway definitely not "blue"
dannyno
  • 85. dannyno | 12/05/2021
Another angle, which may or may not help.

From Colin Wilson, The Outsider (p.261 of the Weidenfeld & Nicolson/Orion 2001 reissue):


... there is no division of opinion: Go to extremes. That is the first necessity. The Buddha advocated a 'middle way', yet this was only after a preliminary course of extremes.


There's quite a bit of extreme-advocacy of particular kinds in the book.
bzfgt
  • 86. bzfgt (link) | 22/05/2021
I'm thinking "Evil is not in the extremes" is an idea also perhaps inspired by Blake, "Opposition is true friendship" and all he says about "Without contraries is no true progression."

If there is any cohesion to this, the idea that the "middle mass" is the real evil, then the protagonist is an example of such...then "The Wehrmacht never got in here": 1. Bluster from the middle masser, or 2. pointing out there is plenty of evil here w/o the german army landing; or, 3. a contrary view of the British middlers
SB
  • 87. SB | 06/06/2021
"Black room brain" is a reference to Colin Wilson's philosophical spy novel (!), The Black Room. I was going to say more about what the black room signifies but this is much better:

https://medium.com/@dmoore629/the-tao-of-the-new-existentialism-the-black-room-1971-by-colin-wilson-1b81b996cbac
plastikman
  • 88. plastikman | 10/06/2021
(4) set at nought could well be a Spinal Tap reference ie. set to 11
So maybe Mark E set Mark R's amp to 0.....just for a larf 'n that.
bzfgt
  • 89. bzfgt (link) | 12/06/2021
I cannot use the Wayback Machine lately, I keep getting error pages when I try to save something
dannyno
  • 90. dannyno | 13/06/2021
I think they have problems now and then. I've had some similar experiences.
dannyno
  • 91. dannyno | 13/06/2021
Comment #88, plastikman:


set at nought could well be a Spinal Tap reference


It absolutely can't be a Spinal Tap reference, though, can it?

The song debuted in December 1980 and appeared on record in April 1981.

Whereas This is Spinal Tap came out in the US in March 1984 and doesn't seem to have hit UK cinemas until the autumn.
bzfgt
  • 92. bzfgt (link) | 19/06/2021
They did appear in a sketch in 1979, although I don't know if it involved 11. Still, seems unlikely. In any case even if this came out after the movie that seems like a massive stretch to me...still, firing out ideas like that is grist for the mill, not to criticize....
bzfgt
  • 93. bzfgt (link) | 19/06/2021
Wayback still not working for me, it's been weeks
dannyno
  • 94. dannyno | 20/06/2021
This is the 1979 debut of Spinal Tap:



Nothing about "11".
dannyno
  • 95. dannyno | 24/06/2021
Summer close season
A quiet dope and cider man
But during the season
Hard drugs and cider mates


MES, in Renegade, chapter 1:


Outside of school there were always the cider gangs and all that.
deedeesea
  • 96. deedeesea | 27/06/2021
Always thought it was " let me hear you whisper ,Bob" in reference to "Whispering" Bob Harris ...bunny toothed Old Grey Whistle Test hippie presenter !...
bzfgt
  • 97. bzfgt (link) | 02/07/2021
Yeah I remember him mentioning "cider gangs," which sounds hilarious to me....maybe not to a Brit, I dunno
Portsmouth Bubblejet
  • 98. Portsmouth Bubblejet | 09/10/2021
I can definitely see the digs at Switzerland throughout this song, and would second the German word 'Mittelmaß' as the likely origin of the title. Note too that 'Bub' is a word used in Switzerland, South Germany and Austria for a 'boy' or a 'young man', so this may have fed into the line '...and living here you whisper, bub!'

The particular target of Smith's animus would appear to be Swiss self-satisfaction at not being invaded by Nazi Germany ('The Wehrmacht never got in here') during the six years of World War II ('though it took us six years'). This smugness as regards Switzerland's traditional neutrality, i.e. being in the 'middle' of left-wing and right-wing world politics, masks the fact that Swiss border officials routinely turned away Jewish refugees fleeing Nazi Germany. The total number of refugees who were rejected was believed to gave been around 20,000 - see this Guardian article for details - although recent Swiss research estimates the number of rejected refugees as being much lower.

The longstanding dispute over withheld access to Jewish assets in dormant Swiss accounts also casts aspersions on the limitations of Swiss neutrality during World War II.
dannyno
  • 99. dannyno | 22/10/2021
I've tended to think of the Wehrmacht line as referring to Britain, but certainly Switzerland would work as well.

I guess as always it's unclear whether there is, or was intended to be, a single narrative here, but you make a good case.

I like the info about "bub".
gappy
  • 100. gappy | 10/01/2022
I'm listening to a live version now, one of the cases where the "come into the back room, Brian" line is very clear.

My suspicion is that only one of "come into the back room, Brian" and "a [...] back-room brain" are from the original work on the lyrics, and the other is just an anagrammatic play, such as in "cavalry and Calvary", My bet is that "come into the back room, Brian" is the original part, whether this is referring to a specific Brian or not, and then got adapted to "back room brain", which seem to fit with a Tin Pan Alley mentality.

Can't prove it, though, of course :)
Dr X O'Skeleton
  • 101. Dr X O'Skeleton | 25/07/2022
/the use of the name Brian would fit in with the football explanation. Brian Moore presented ITV's World of Sport in the UK back then and may have conducted interviews in the 'back room'. ie dressing room
HP Mayo
  • 102. HP Mayo | 27/12/2022
The main theme I get from this song is that middle class aspirations allow great evil to enter society as they are completely reluctant to take any stance that might impact on said aspirations. Most analysis of fascism, especially the Nazi Germany variant, and how it came to be, usually concludes that the indifference from the majority of society is how they rose to power and the reality only dawned on most when ‘they came for me.’ That indifference or neutrality is why lots of political commentators usually conclude that centrism only favours hierarchy and always concludes in an authoritarian state. A cripple state.
Alex
  • 103. Alex | 18/05/2023
After "the boy is like an uh-uh," he quietly says "he's running from the middle mass." Could be in parentheses. If you don't believe me, listen with headphones.
Mark Oliver
  • 104. Mark Oliver | 31/08/2023
Am familiar with 'Bub' from old Yankee films and telly, but no, not used in UK..however, in Brummagem, they call each other 'Bab' (not 'Babe'). Probably unrelated..
dannyno
  • 105. dannyno | 02/03/2024
Re note 1, Paul Saxton, who came up with the Mike Gaines/soft mitts analysis, admitted on the Fallnet mailing list in 2004 that he had completely made it up.

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